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12/08/2009

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dvbrauer

Of course the argument would be that the U.S. government can be trusted (unlike the Afghanistan or Iraq governments) to hunt down terrorists put them in prison.

jesusluvsguns

Interesting question. Although in theory one could agree, reality is another story. We can't possibly expect Afghanistan/Pakistan to be effective at capturing people who commit crimes against the US. Both because it can create potential internal political problems as well as the obvious fact that they really don't have the resources. Here in the US we have those resources AND the political will to do so.
The real question is what are our values as a nation? Do we support killing thousands of innocents in the name of justice for a few? And if we do, how do we define our methods into law and maintain the moral high ground? This is not a black and white issue.

Laurie Essig

Oh, I think the world trusts the US to "do the right thing." I mean, what's not to trust? Destroying the Geneva Conventions; torture of prisoners; extraordinary renditions; etc. In other words, there are probably a lot of people around the world hoping the Indian/Denmark armies invade soon.

jesusluvsguns

Agreed on all points. My question would be how do we merge our desire of maintaining the moral high ground with our need to defend ourselves? Certainly you and I (not that I'm speaking for you) agree that if someone killed one of your loved ones, you would want the perpetrators to be brought to justice. We can agree that if said perpetrators are located in Afghanistan we shouldn't invade Iraq and kill thousands in the process. Where it gets fuzzy is how do we approach Afghanistan and Pakistan where we know these people are? I don't think carpet bombing is an acceptable method but what is? Are there acceptable casualties? What do you propose we do?

Todd Essig

Invasion? Maybe not. Perhaps Canada will provide India and Denmark with a base for their Predator drones. They can then safely, and surgically, remove suspected terrorists from within American cities. Since we've already shown that our system, with all those infernal checks-and-balances and damn Constitutional protections, can't be counted on to protect Denmark and India from the likes of Headley, we should be OK with this solution. The Indians and the Danes have a right to protect themselves!

Laurie Essig

I rather doubt bombing civilians in Afghanistan has brought justice or peace to anyone who lost loved ones on 9/11. Is there a place for special forces, CIA type ops where individuals would be arrested or possibly killed? Sure. But military invasion is different. And who has died in Afghanistan? Al Qaeda operatives? No. My actual suggestion- if I were in charge- end the war. There is no "good" ending to this- just tens and hundreds of thousands of more dead civilians, destroyed lives, and more reasons to hate the US. In order to repair some of the harm the US government has done there, 1/2 of the $100 BILLION funding for the war should be spent supporting NGOs who are building infrastructure and schools. It's not a good ending, but it's way better than the alternative.

jesusluvsguns

I agree we should end the war. Now! I also think we should persue these criminals. IMO the best way is to use special forces combined with local intelligence. The problem with that now, of course, is who would help us without the time honored use of bribery? Nobody. It's a conundrum.
As far as your idea to throw money at NGO's. Aside from waging this massive war, that would be a total waste. These societies really are about at least 100 years behind the western world. Really. They aren't going to appreciate our efforts because they have no frame of reference. Until they "see the light" on their own (don't hold your breath) we shouldn't waste one dime on them. I would rather see us pour the money into reducing our debt. Then we should spend to help the less fortunate here in our own society. Then we can talk about spending anything on foreign soil.

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